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Fishin4mypkr

A Beginner's Guide to RuneScapic Efficiency

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Welcome to the Guide:

The point of this guide is to show the most efficient way of achieving a skill cape or any long-term goal. While I am no Jardeath, I shall try to explain my reasoning in getting the most out of my time that I invest into RuneScape. Reaching max efficiency has completely changed my entire way I play the game and if you agree if may change yours as well. :runepick:

chickencar.jpg

http://www.savagechickens.com/2008/05/high-efficiency.html

Table of Content:

-Before you plan for any goal

-Choosing Your Goal and the Best Training Methods

-Formulas to Finding Max Efficiency

-Example of an Efficiency Calculations

-How Much GP/hr You Must Make To Make The Expensive Method Efficient

-Adapting The Formula To Your Needs

-Conclusions

Before You Plan for Any Goal:

-Agree with me that efficiency is based off achieving your goal the quickest in terms of hours spent on RuneScape (including making money back).

• What I’m saying is that you must agree that using the least GP/XP is not necessarily the best way to reach a goal. While this may be a huge factor in the way you skill, read further to hear my explanations.

-Calculate your best moneymaking method.

• Now this is possibly the most important part of reaching a goal, especially if it is a very expensive skill and require some time testing. I would test your three best current moneymaking methods (killing dragons etc) and
test each for at least an hour to determine the amount of items/kills you receive per hour as this will come to be a huge factor in reaching max efficiency. Due to the ever-changing RuneScape economy, you will never really have a set GP/hr. For this reason, it is must smarter to calculate your potential profit at the current time that you will be killing/skilling.
A couple reminders: do not forget to subtract the cost of supplies and do not exaggerate numbers of how much you make (no one is looking and it will only hurt you!). Also, don’t choose something that you could not see yourself doing for 20+ hours. For example, instead of cleaning 5,000 herbs an hour, I would choose to kill green dragons. Something that is also something to keep in mind is getting experience while making money; I would far rather get 40k xp/hr and make 350k GP/hr than make 375k GP/hr with no skills involved.

-Make sure that you always have the necessary stats/supplies to make money.

•It is essential to hold onto the supplies you need to make your maximum GP, so don't overspend.

Choosing Your Goal and the Best Training Methods:

-Choose your goal

•Goals are always fun to accomplish and may be fewer hours away than you think. Why not pick something challenging?! Noob triangles are FTL. Note how much experience you are away from reaching your goal.

-Assess the best training methods

•Research your specific skill to find what appears to be the most efficient and sometimes the most popular way to train the skill. PLEASE remember that the most popular way to train a skill is often not the most efficient way to train it. Also, don’t shy away from what appear to be expensive ways to train a skill especially if you find yourself able to make more than 400k GP/hr.

-Test your training methods

•While testing your methods, find these categories out:

-GP Gained/Lost per hour by training

-XP Gained per hour in your specific skill

-Maximum moneymaking GP/hr

(These will plug into the efficiency formulas)

Formulas to Finding Max Efficiency:

-Finding the hours that it will take to achieve your goal

•If you already know your maximum ability to moneymaking, these formulas become

much simpler.

(Total Experience Needed) = (XP/hr) x (variable – hours needed),

so

Hours Needed = (Total Experience)/(XP/hr)

Once you find how many hours needed, you then also need to find how many hours it will take you to make that money lost back.

Total Money Lost = (GP loss per hour) x (hours needed)

With this,

Hours spent making money lost = (Total Money Lost) / (Maximum moneymaking capabilities)

So then the total hours needed are:

Formula for Max Efficiency

Total Hours = (Total Experience Needed)/(XP/hr) - ((GP loss/gain per hour) x ((Total Experience Needed)/(XP/hr)) / (Maximum moneymaking capabilities)

Example of Testing Efficiency:

-Now that seemed a bit overwhelming when I put it all together, so I will use a very simple skill to test it – Firemaking. I will compare the hours needed with maple and magic logs. Before you start, I would recommend grabbing a calculator and a piece of paper to record your notes and hours required.

NOTES:

After testing:

I can firemake 1,100 logs per hour

I can make 600,000 GP/hr

Maples – 135xp; 84 gp each

Magic – 303.8xp; 1431gp each

Maples – 148,500 experience per hour with -92,400 GP/hr

Magic – 334,180 experience per hour with -1,574,100 GP/hr

I want 4,000,000 firemaking experience

Maples:

Total Hours = (4,000,000)/(148,500) – ((-92,400) • (4,000,000/148,500))/(600,000)

= 31.084 total hours.

Magics:

Total Hours = (4,000,000)/(334,180) – ((-1,574,100) • (4,000,000/334,180))/(600,000)

= 43.371 total hours

So, with my moneymaking capabilities, it is inefficient for me to use magic logs over maple logs. These numbers can, however, easily change.

Let’s only change me being able to now make 1,200,000 GP/hr through PVM.

Maples:

Total Hours = (4,000,000)/(148,500) – ((-92,400) • (4,000,000/148,500))/(1,200,000)

= 29.010 hours

Magics:

Total Hours = (4,000,000)/(334,180) – ((-1,574,100) • (4,000,000/334,180))/(1,200,000)

= 27.670 hours

So, now using magic logs becomes more effective that maple logs. You can even go further to say that using magics is WAY more efficient because of the possible Effigy that a monster drops, which can lead to even more experience, possibly even in the skill you’re training!

Please note that the formula works both ways, if you gain money while earning experience, it will subtract some time dependant on your max GP/hr. While it may not actually save time while completing your goal, it will save 'X' hours of maximum moneymaking for your next goal. Therefore, if money is not an object, you may want to ignore the formula after the subtraction sign because this will not literally bring down the hours taken on this goal, just help you on your next goal. Also note that while using a calculator, none of the parentheses are necessary due to order of operations.

How Much GP/hr You Must Make To Make The Expensive Method Efficient:

So now that you aren't a rookie anymore, let's find out how much GP/hr you need to make using mahogany tables over oak planks efficient. To accomplish this goal of finding at what point a specific method becomes efficient, you need to set both equations equal to each other and do some simple algebra.

NOTES:

After testing:

I want 4,000,000 construction experience

I can make 'X'k GP/hr

With Oak planks I can make 200k XP/hr

I use 3,333 oak planks per hour with -1,573,176 GP/hr + -78,125 GP/hr inc. cost of butler to a total of -1,651,301 GP/hr

Oak Planks: 472 gp each; 60 xp per

With mahogany planks I can make 550k XP/hr

I use 3,928 mahogany planks per hour with -9,361,785 GP/hr + -141,605 GP/hr inc cost of demon butler to a total of -9,503,390 GP/hr

Mahogany Planks: 2383 gp each; 140 xp per

Setting the Equations Equal: The left being oaks and the right being mahogany

(Total Experience Needed)/(XP/hr) - ((GP loss/gain per hour) x ((Total Experience Needed)/(XP/hr)) / (Maximum moneymaking capabilities) = (Total Experience Needed)/(XP/hr) - ((GP loss/gain per hour) x ((Total Experience Needed)/(XP/hr)) / (Maximum moneymaking capabilities)

(4,000,000)/(200,000) – ((-1,573,176) x (4,000,000)/(200,000)/( X ) = (4,000,000)/(550,000) – ((-9,503,390) x (4,000,000)/(550,000)/( X )

After multiplying both sides by x and subtracting, I ended with:

12.78X = 35,059,689

X = 2,743,324 GP/hr

Therefore, for me, using mahogany planks to make tables over using oak planks to make dungeon doors only becomes efficient if I am able to make greater than 2,743,324 GP/hr.

Adapting the Formula to Your Needs:

The age-old question: Is Stealing Creation an efficient way for me to train a skill? Well to answer the question, it depends on the skill and your GP/hr. While this isn’t as direct as the formula I have previously given above, my formula is meant to adapt. So for the addition, we need to take into consideration the time that is spent getting the tools.

This formula (from above) remains the same:

Total Hours = (Total Experience Needed)/(XP/hr) - ((GP loss/gain per hour) x ((Total Experience Needed)/(XP/hr)) / (Maximum moneymaking capabilities)

Before adding on, it is a necessity to additionally calculate:

How many tools you can get per hour -- Look into using a non-combat clan chat for max efficiency (fast sc, etc.)

How many tools it will take to reach your goal experience

Can be found here: http://runescape.wikia.com/wiki/Proto-tool

Total Tools Needed= (Total Experience Needed)/(Total Experience Per Tool (inc. the exp you would normally receive))

Time Taken to Get Tools = (Total Tools Needed) / (Tools I Can Get Per Hour)

So

Time Taken to Get Tools = (Total Experience Needed)/((Total Experience Per Tool) / (Tools I Can Get Per Hour))

Which leads to the final equation of:

Formula of Max Efficiency Using Stealing Creation

Total Hours = (Total Experience Needed)/(XP/hr) - ((GP loss/gain per hour) x ((Total Experience Needed)/(XP/hr)) / (Maximum moneymaking capabilities) + (Total Experience Needed)/(Total Experience Per Tool)/(Tools I Can Get Per Hour)

Whew that’s a lot to plug into the calculator but it’ll be worth it! Let’s use construction on oak dungeon doors to test it out using the tools vs. not bothering to get them.

NOTES:

After testing:

I want 4,000,000 construction experience

I can make 500k GP/hr

I can make 200k XP/hr

I use 3,333 oak planks per hour with -1,573,176 GP/hr + -78,125 GP/hr inc. cost of butler to a total of -1,651,301 GP/hr

Oak Planks: 472 gp each; 60 xp per

I can get 4 SC proto-tools an hour

Each tool is worth 50,750 total experience

Total Hours = (Total Experience Needed)/(XP/hr) - ((GP loss/gain per hour) x ((Total Experience Needed)/(XP/hr)) / (Maximum moneymaking capabilities) + (Total Experience Needed)/((Total Experience Per Tool)/(Tools I Can Get Per Hour))

With Using Stealing Creation:

Total Hours = (4,000,000)/(400,000) – (-1,651,301) x ((4,000,000)/(400,000))/(500,000) + (4,000,000)/((50750)/(4))

= 62.730 Total Hours -- Notice I doubled the XP/hr that I can get due to the 2x nature of the tools. The cost per plank is still the same, but you only spent half the time constructing, so only half usual the planks are used.

Without Using Stealing Creation:

Total Hours = (4,000,000)/(200,000) – (-1,651,301) x ((4,000,000)/(200,000))/(500,000)

= 86.052 Total Hours

Therefore, it is far more efficient to spend time getting tools if I can make 500,000 GP/hr.

Now, let’s use different numbers and say I can theoretically make 1.75M GP/hr PVM’ing

With Stealing Creation:

Total Hours = (4,000,000)/(400,000) – (-1,651,301) x ((4,000,000)/(400,000))/(1,750,000) + (4,000,000)/((50750)/(4))

= 39.140 Total Hours

Without Stealing Creation:

Total Hours = (4,000,000)/(200,000) – (-1,651,301) x ((4,000,000)/(200,000))/(1,750,000)

= 38.872 Total Hours

Only when it gets to such high profits as 1.75M GP/hr does not using non-combat stealing creation become efficient. Surprising? I definitely think so, but money saved in expensive stats can go a long way. So basically, according to my trial runs and using oak dungeon doors, if I cannot make over 1.75M GP/hr than I should be playing Stealing Creation for hammers. Just remember that your personal speed will be different than me, so it is ESSENTIAL to get your data. Note that order of operations will still take the parentheses away.

Conclusions:

While there are other ways to create formulas based on efficiency, I have created this one to help those looking more for simplicity and straightforwardness. I consider this a beginner's guide because there are some complex things left out like getting the max efficiency for making GP/hr etc, but I figured that this guide would really have helped me a few months ago :)

Credits:

-Meow Meowwww for editting

-Tore for always answering my noob questions on efficiency, giving me motivation to write this guide, and sprouting ideas for new sections

-Jar for checking over my work to make sure I wasn't making a fool of myself

-RuneWiki for being there for me when no one else was

-David for making my guide easier to read

-Joshua for the awesome suggestions

DISCLAIMER: Play RuneScape for fun! For me, finding max efficiency is what I play for. If it's not your thing/you don't find it fun, why be unhappy... It's a game for goodness sake.

Edited by fishin4mypkr
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I approve of this guide of a subject which has highly affected my ways of playing RS since I started thinking about how I could cut down my training hours :)

Some tips though on the format of the guide, in your calculations you write for instance

Total Hours = (4000000)/(334180) – ((-1574100) • (4000000/334180))/(600000)

= 43.371 total hours

This would look a lot better IMO if you used a 1000 separator, ie:

Total Hours = (4,000,000)/(334,180) – ((-1,574,100) • (4,000,000/334,180))/(600,000)

= 43.371 total hours

Just looks neater :)

Also for calculating your Moneymaking methods, it's better to note down items collected/made per hour instead of money made, because prices fluctuate. If you know how many frost dragons you can kill per hour it's easy to calculate how much you can make, rather than just remembering that "last time I tested I made 2.5M an hour, but no idea how many bones etc" I got to make up that amount. If I know I got 150 kills an hour, I can easily calculate the value :) Also, frost drags are a lot more than 1.2M an hour as you've written.

Aside from that well written guide

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This was a nice guide for people who are looking to increase their efficiency. However, I often deviate from the "most efficient" methods because I play for fun. No point in grinding through some boring method just because it's the best. I would rather take a few extra hours and enjoy what I'm doing. One way I look at it is that I might take a few hours longer in the game, but doing the more efficient method would burn me out faster and I would be inclined to play less overall, so I actually increase my efficiency by going slower or rather a funner way. Just my thoughts, keep up the good work Todd!

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Good guide for those looking to be effective. I play casually and can never stick to one skill for very long so I spread myself over many skills using the method I enjoy the most.

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The saving chickens picture made me laugh out loud.

The wording in this paragraph was somewhat confusing, but maybe because the information is very obvious... mostly the red part:

-Make sure that you always have the necessary stats/supplies to make money.

• While this may sound completely self-explanatory, overspending is incredibly stupid (for example not being able to afford a dragon scimitar so you have to resort to a dagger). It is always better to have the supplies than possibly finding yourself digging for GP to make money your best way.

I would add a section on how to make an efficiency calculator on Excel sort of like Gold's guide to merchanting... or... you could team up with Aprz and see if he could make some kind of input table using your formulas so that it would give the output results to each person that stops by your guide. I bet it would not be too hard, and it would be really sick!

I would do more touch up on advance training methods instead of recommending to look it up. Research a few on your own and post 'em up as examples of how to get best results. You even could, with the permission of the original writers, add a link to some guides you thought provided some good advance training methods.

I think it would be a good idea to post up some common mistakes too so people know what to watch out for. I know some people "think" they are being efficient and find out later that their opportunity cost was too great.

That ought to really help your guide out and expand it more.

Other than that, it is a very good guide ;) great job!

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"Before you start, I would reccomend grabbing a calculator and a piece of paper to record your notes and hours required."

You misspelled recommend in your guide... :runepick:

Located second line of Examples of Testing Efficiency

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I would add a section on how to make an efficiency calculator on Excel sort of like Gold's guide to merchanting... or... you could team up with Aprz and see if he could make some kind of input table using your formulas so that it would give the output results to each person that stops by your guide. I bet it would not be too hard, and it would be really sick!

I would love to do this but have no idea how to even begin with this. Maybe you could get Aprz over here? :P

I would do more touch up on advance training methods instead of recommending to look it up. Research a few on your own and post 'em up as examples of how to get best results. You even could, with the permission of the original writers, add a link to some guides you thought provided some good advance training methods.

As in more examples than just firemaking? And yes maybe I could steal Tore's math in his slayer guide. With his permission of course.

I think it would be a good idea to post up some common mistakes too so people know what to watch out for. I know some people "think" they are being efficient and find out later that their opportunity cost was too great.

Good idea I should get to work.

I really appreciate the comments and have tried to incorporate the input to make the guide more straightforward :king:

EDIT: I have added in a new section on stealing creation and adapting the formula :)

Edited by fishin4mypkr

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Even tho I mostly play this game for fun when I make my money and do not really care for efficiency. I find this guide very helpful for those who do care for it.

Good job on writing it ^_^

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I don't know if it is possible or not with the compatibility with the forum etc, but is it possible to use something like mathtype or another formula writing tool for this guide? It would make it a lot easier for people to visualize your formulas. Also, in your stealing creation section I would use a different method of organization, it's kind of hard to read with so much double spacing, I would maybe change it to something like the following to aid in legibility.

With Using Stealing Creation:

Total Hours = (4,000,000)/(400,000) – (-1,651,301) x ((4,000,000)/(400,000))/(500,000) + (4,000,000)/((50750)/(4))

= 62.730 Total Hours

-- Notice I doubled the XP/hr that I can get due to the 2x nature of the tools. The cost per plank is still the same, but you only spent half the time constructing, so only half usual the planks are used.

Without Using Stealing Creation:

Total Hours = (4,000,000)/(200,000) – (-1,651,301) x ((4,000,000)/(200,000))/(500,000)

= 86.052 Total Hours

Therefore, it is far more efficient to spend time getting tools if I can make 500,000 GP/hr.

Now, let’s use different numbers and say I can theoretically make 1.75M GP/hr PVM’ing

With Stealing Creation:

Total Hours = (4,000,000)/(400,000) – (-1,651,301) x ((4,000,000)/(400,000))/(1,750,000) + (4,000,000)/((50750)/(4))

= 39.140 Total Hours

Without Stealing Creation:

Total Hours = (4,000,000)/(200,000) – (-1,651,301) x ((4,000,000)/(200,000))/(1,750,000)

= 38.872 Total Hours

I hope that helps, great guide Todd, my nephew is throwing up all over the bed, I got to go but I'll read over it again later and see if I see anything else.

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Excellent suggestion Ahsgreenwave! That really does make it a lot easier to follow. Good use of your available resources.

Guide has some great developments I see. I hate to nitpick but yellow is such a difficult colour to see. I know it's just a note but... yellow... it's tough :unsure:. You could probably italicize your notes or type the word NOTES in caps.

For example,

NOTES:

After testing:

I can firemake 1,100 logs per hour

I can make 600,000 GP/hr

Maples – 135xp; 84 gp each

Magic – 303.8xp; 1431gp each

Maples – 148,500 experience per hour with -92,400 GP/hr

Magic – 334,180 experience per hour with -1,574,100 GP/hr

I want 4,000,000 firemaking experience

NOTES vs Notes

That or just try a different colour. Might be too many colours in the guide though; that could get too distracting.

I forgot to suggest the use of

[QUOTE][/QUOTE]

It would go perfect with your original or generic formula to finding max efficiency and makes a large emphasis on it since it's one of the most important part of your guide.

For example,

Formula for max efficiency

Total Hours = (Total Experience Needed)/(XP/hr) - ((GP loss/gain per hour) x ((Total Experience Needed)/(XP/hr)) / (Maximum moneymaking capabilities)

Formula for max efficiency for your personal needs

Total Hours = (Total Experience Needed)/(XP/hr) - ((GP loss/gain per hour) x ((Total Experience Needed)/(XP/hr)) / (Maximum moneymaking capabilities) + (Total Experience Needed)/(Total Experience Per Tool)/(Tools I Can Get Per Hour)

You're doing great. This guide is dripping with success!

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I have made some strong improvements to the guide and that is thanks to the Masors community. Thanks guys for the suggestions. :)

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I took the liberty of throwing together a quick calculator for this, sadly only for windows atm. If anyone care to turn it into java here is the source code written in .net, Requires at least 5 textboxes and a button to work

Nothing advanced tbh pretty much simple as it skips a few things.


Public Class Form1
Dim a As Double
Dim b As Double
Dim c As Double
Dim d As Double
Dim f As Double

Private Sub Form1_Load(ByVal sender As System.Object, ByVal e As System.EventArgs) Handles MyBase.Load
a = 0
b = 0
c = 0
d = 0
f = 0
End Sub

Private Sub Button1_Click(ByVal sender As System.Object, ByVal e As System.EventArgs) Handles Button1.Click
a = TextBox1.Text
b = TextBox2.Text
c = TextBox3.Text
d = TextBox4.Text
f = (a / B) - ((c * (a / B)) / (d))
If c >= 0 Then
f = (a / B)
End If
TextBox5.Text = f
End Sub

End Class

http://home.hbexom.operaunite.com/file_sharing/content/

Pass: Holykebab

Just navigate to the Runescape folder and download the "Efficiency calculator.exe"

Oh ya, your calculation is weak on the point when you make profit, it means you will spend less time to train the skill.

For example, you make up about 170k gp per hour making yew longbows by stringing the unf. longbows with a gain of about 130k xp per hour. tho it should take ~ 81 hours to reach 99 from level 82. Due to the money gain/loss in your calculation say while c(money loss/gain per hour) is positive and maximum moneymaking cap(d) per hour of 2m, f(total hours) would be ~ 75 hours.

I'd recommend saying that IF c is greater than or equal to 0 (skill is profitable), only use a/b, (total xp needed/xp per hour)

Edited by guthian

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This is a guide guide now! I have no further criticism for to stress your guide and better it. It's very easy to follow step-by-step and has many examples, well written, organized + it has one funny picture; you can't beat that.

Job well done B) +1

I will recommend this guide to others. Thanks fishin4mypkr!

Of course, we can't just simply say that you are done. I know that there are others out there reading through your guide and we must abide by the laws of Guide Submissions. I have to admit though, you got a lot done within two days. I'm highly impressed- I wish you wrote this guide while I was a Guide-EM lol.

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I took the liberty of throwing together a quick calculator for this, sadly only for windows atm. If anyone care to turn it into java here is the source code written in .net, Requires at least 5 textboxes and a button to work

Nothing advanced tbh pretty much simple as it skips a few things.


Public Class Form1
Dim a As Double
Dim b As Double
Dim c As Double
Dim d As Double
Dim f As Double

Private Sub Form1_Load(ByVal sender As System.Object, ByVal e As System.EventArgs) Handles MyBase.Load
a = 0
b = 0
c = 0
d = 0
f = 0
End Sub

Private Sub Button1_Click(ByVal sender As System.Object, ByVal e As System.EventArgs) Handles Button1.Click
a = TextBox1.Text
b = TextBox2.Text
c = TextBox3.Text
d = TextBox4.Text
f = (a / B) - ((c * (a / B)) / (d))
If c >= 0 Then
f = (a / B)
End If
TextBox5.Text = f
End Sub

End Class

http://home.hbexom.operaunite.com/file_sharing/content/

Pass: Holykebab

Just navigate to the Runescape folder and download the "Efficiency calculator.exe"

I really appreciate this but I cannot seem to get it to work. I do also have a Mac so that may be my problem.

Oh ya, your calculation is weak on the point when you make profit, it means you will spend less time to train the skill.

For example, you make up about 170k gp per hour making yew longbows by stringing the unf. longbows with a gain of about 130k xp per hour. tho it should take ~ 81 hours to reach 99 from level 82. Due to the money gain/loss in your calculation say while c(money loss/gain per hour) is positive and maximum moneymaking cap(d) per hour of 2m, f(total hours) would be ~ 75 hours.

I'd recommend saying that IF c is greater than or equal to 0 (skill is profitable), only use a/b, (total xp needed/xp per hour)

Okay, so while writing this guide, I did some serious thinking about this concept. Instead of doing what you said and ignoring the profits made, I chose to have it reduce time because this time saved will translate to your next goal. For instance, even though it takes you literally ~81 hours to complete the fletching goal from 82-99, the profits you make would save you ~6 hours of max moneymaking capabilities on your next goal. For me, money is always an issue because I tend not to have more cash than only what I need to make my max profit, so this saved 6 hours is a huge deal for my next goal. Thank you for bringing this up and I will add a note in the actual guide.

Thanks Josh I really appreciate it :)

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I really appreciate this but I cannot seem to get it to work. I do also have a Mac so that may be my problem.

I have made it java, as I mentioned it only worked for windows before, now its however, multi-language allowing it to run on any operating system who have java as its written in java. the file still exist on the same webpage, however is now named "Efficiency Calculator(Multilang Java).jar"

Feel free to try it out ^^

Edited by guthian
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